Difference between revisions of "M85 (12.7 mm)"

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{{AutoWeapon-Card
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[[File:M85.png|x280px|thumb|righ|The M85 on top of the XM-1 (GM)]]
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|image = File:Weapon_M85_12.7mm.jpg
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== Description ==
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|title = {{PAGENAME}}
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<!-- ''Write an introduction to the article in 2-3 small paragraphs. Briefly tell us about the history of the development and combat using the weaponry and also about its features. Compile a list of air, ground, or naval vehicles that feature this weapon system in the game.'' -->
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|MG-calibre = 12.7
 
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|Belt-capacity = 200
 
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|RoF = 576
 
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|MG-velocity = 856 - 944
 
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|MG-max-pen = 26
 
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}}
 
  
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== Description ==
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The '''M85''' is an American .50 cal (12.7 mm) heavy machine gun. The machine gun is mainly found in place of the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]] machine gun, on some high rank American tanks (mainly as a commander's gun on the M48 and M60 Patton series). Being a 12.7 mm heavy machine gun the M85 has a reasonable amount of armour penetration, and higher damage output than medium and general purpose machine guns. This makes it much more effective at engaging weakly armoured enemy tanks, as well as aircraft.
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<!-- Write an introduction to the article in 2-3 small paragraphs. Briefly tell about the history of the development and combat using of the weaponry and also about it's features. Make a air or ground vehicles list on which this weapon is installed in our game. -->
 
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The '''M85''' is an American .50 cal (12.7 mm) heavy machine gun. The machine gun is mainly found in place of the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]] machine gun, on some high rank American Tanks (mainly as a commander's gun on the M48 and M60 Patton series). Being a 12.7 mm heavy machine gun the M85 has an ok amount of armour penetration, and higher damage output than medium and general purpose machine guns. This makes it much more effective at engaging weakly armoured enemy tank, as well as aircraft.
 
  
 
=== Vehicles equipped with this weapon ===
 
=== Vehicles equipped with this weapon ===
 +
<!-- ''List out vehicles that are equipped with the weapon.'' -->
  
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* [[M48A1]]
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{{Navigation-Start|Vehicles equipped with this weapon}}
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* [[M60]]
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* [[M60A1 (AOS)]]
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{{Navigation-Line|'''Medium tanks'''}}{{Specs-Link|il_magach_6a}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_m728}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_xm_803}}
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* [[M60A1 RISE (P)]]
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{{Navigation-Line|M60}}{{Specs-Link|us_m60}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|it_m60a1_ariete}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_m60a1}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_m60a1_rise_passive_era}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_m60a2}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_m60a3_tts}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|cn_m60a3_tts}}
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* [[M60A2]]
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{{Navigation-Line|XM-1}}{{Specs-Link|us_xm1_chrysler}}{{-}}{{Specs-Link|us_xm1_gm}}
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* [[M60A1 "D.C.Ariete"]]
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* [[XM-1 (GM)]]
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{{Navigation-End}}
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* [[XM-1 (Chrysler)]]
 
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* [[XM-803]]
 
  
 
== General info ==
 
== General info ==
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<!-- Tell us about the tactical and technical characteristics of the cannon or machine gun. -->
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<!-- ''Tell us about the tactical and technical characteristics of the cannon or machine gun.'' -->
 
The M85 is a fairly standard 12.7 mm heavy machine gun. Despite being a completely separate weapon, it preforms almost completely identically to the much more widespread [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]] heavy machine gun.
 
The M85 is a fairly standard 12.7 mm heavy machine gun. Despite being a completely separate weapon, it preforms almost completely identically to the much more widespread [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]] heavy machine gun.
  
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=== Available shells ===
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=== Available ammunition ===
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<!-- Describe the shells that are available for the cannon and their features and purpose. If it concerns autocannons or machine guns, so write about different ammo belts and what is inside (which types of shells). -->
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<!-- ''Describe the shells that are available for the weapon and their features and purpose. If it concerns autocannons or machine guns, write about different ammo belts and what is inside (which types of shells).'' -->
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The M85 can only be equipped with one ammo belt consisting of one Armour Piercing Incendiary Tracer (API-T) bullet, followed by one Incendiary (I) bullet, followed by one Armour Piecing (AP) bullet, followed by another API-T bullet. The AP bullet has the most penetration at 26 mm maximum, followed by the API-T bullet with 23 mm maximum. The incendiary bullet has very poor penetration with a maximum penetration of 2 mm.
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The M85 can only be equipped with one ammo belt consisting of four M8 Armour-piercing incendiary (AP-I) bullets, followed by a single M20 Armour-piercing incendiary tracer bullet.
  
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{| class="wikitable sortable" style="text-align:center" width="100%"
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'''Default''': {{Annotation|AP-I|Armour-piercing incendiary}}{{-}}{{Annotation|AP-I|Armour-piercing incendiary}}{{-}}{{Annotation|AP-I|Armour-piercing incendiary}}{{-}}{{Annotation|AP-I|Armour-piercing incendiary}}{{-}}{{Annotation|API-T|Armour-piercing incendiary tracer}}
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! colspan="10" | Penetration statistics
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|-
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{{:{{PAGENAME}}/Ammunition|AP-I, API-T}}
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! rowspan="2" data-sort-type="text" | Ammunition
 
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! colspan="8" | '''Penetration''' '''''in mm''''' '''@ 90°'''
 
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|-
 
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! 10m
 
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! 100m
 
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! 500m
 
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! 1,000m
 
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! 1,450m
 
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! 1,500m
 
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! 2,000m
 
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! 2,500m
 
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|-
 
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| API-T || 23 || 22 || 16 || 10 || N/A || 6 || 5 || 3
 
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|-
 
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| I || 2 || 2 || 1.5 || 1 || 0.5 || 0 || 0 || 0
 
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|-
 
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| AP || 26 || 25 || 19 || 12 || N/A || 7 || 4 || 3
 
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|-
 
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|}
 
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{| class="wikitable sortable" style="text-align:center" width="100%"
 
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! colspan="10" | Shell details
 
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|-
 
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! rowspan="2" data-sort-type="text" | Ammunition
 
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! rowspan="2" |Velocity <br /> in m/s
 
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! rowspan="2" |Projectile<br />Mass in kg
 
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! rowspan="2" | ''Fuse delay''
 
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''in m:''
 
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! rowspan="2" | ''Fuse sensitivity''
 
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''in mm:''
 
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! rowspan="2" | ''Explosive Mass in g<br /> (TNT equivalent):''
 
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! rowspan="2" | ''Normalization At 30° <br> from horizontal:''
 
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! colspan="3" | ''Ricochet:''
 
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|-
 
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! 0%
 
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! 50%
 
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! 100%
 
−
|-
 
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| API-T || 887 || 0.0403 || N/A || N/A || N/A || ??° || ??° || ??° || ??°
 
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|-
 
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| I || 944 || 0.041 || N/A || N/A || N/A || ??° || ??° || ??° || ??°
 
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|-
 
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| I || 856 || 0.046 || N/A || N/A || N/A || ??° || ??° || ??° || ??°
 
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|}
 
  
 
=== Comparison with analogues ===
 
=== Comparison with analogues ===
−
<!-- Give a comparative description of cannons/machine guns, that have firepower equal to these type of weapons. -->
+
<!-- ''Give a comparative description of cannons/machine guns that have firepower equal to this weapon.'' -->
 
The M85 performs functionally identically to the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]] machine gun found on most previous American tanks, as well as in other nation's tech tree. Like the M2HB it has a slightly lower rate of fire than other 12.7 mm machine guns, but has a larger belt capacity.
 
The M85 performs functionally identically to the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]] machine gun found on most previous American tanks, as well as in other nation's tech tree. Like the M2HB it has a slightly lower rate of fire than other 12.7 mm machine guns, but has a larger belt capacity.
  
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== Usage in the battles ==
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== Usage in battles ==
−
<!-- Describe the cannon/machine gun in the game - its distinctive features, tactics of usage against the main opponents. Please don't write a "guide" - do not impose a single point of view, but give the reader food for thought. -->
+
<!-- ''Describe the cannon/machine gun in the game - its distinctive features, tactics of usage against notable opponents. Please don't write a "guide" - do not impose a single point of view, but give the reader food for thought.'' -->
 
Unlike lower calibre machine guns the M85 has enough penetration to be able to penetrate the armour of lightly armoured tanks (or the side / rear armour of some more heavily armoured tanks, bullets can also sometimes make it through armour holes such as the turret ring, or mg port of tanks, injuring crew members. Like all other machine guns it can be used for incapacitating exposed crew members, as well as marking enemy vehicles and obscuring the view of enemy players (shooting at their gun sight). It also does more damage to enemy aircraft than lower calibre machine guns, and is usually mounted on top of the turret, making aiming at aircraft much easier than with a co-axial gun. Clearing trees and bushes is another use.
 
Unlike lower calibre machine guns the M85 has enough penetration to be able to penetrate the armour of lightly armoured tanks (or the side / rear armour of some more heavily armoured tanks, bullets can also sometimes make it through armour holes such as the turret ring, or mg port of tanks, injuring crew members. Like all other machine guns it can be used for incapacitating exposed crew members, as well as marking enemy vehicles and obscuring the view of enemy players (shooting at their gun sight). It also does more damage to enemy aircraft than lower calibre machine guns, and is usually mounted on top of the turret, making aiming at aircraft much easier than with a co-axial gun. Clearing trees and bushes is another use.
  
 
=== Pros and cons ===
 
=== Pros and cons ===
−
<!-- Summarize and briefly evaluate the weaponry in terms of its characteristics and combat effectiveness. Mark pros and cons as a list. -->
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<!-- ''Summarise and briefly evaluate the weaponry in terms of its characteristics and combat effectiveness. Mark pros and cons as a list.'' -->
  
 
'''Pros:'''
 
'''Pros:'''
−
 
 
* Enough penetration to damage some enemy vehicles
 
* Enough penetration to damage some enemy vehicles
 
* Good belt capacity
 
* Good belt capacity
 
* Rate of fire is ok
 
* Rate of fire is ok
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* 3/4 (75%) rounds in the belt have good penetration
 
  
 
'''Cons:'''
 
'''Cons:'''
−
 
 
* Slower rate of fire than Soviet 12.7 mm machine guns
 
* Slower rate of fire than Soviet 12.7 mm machine guns
  
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== Historical part ==
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== History ==
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<!--''Examine the history of the creation and combat usage of this weapon. If the historical reference turns out to be too big, take it to a separate article, taking a link to an article about the vehicle and adding a block "/ History" (example: <nowiki>https://wiki.warthunder.com/(weapon-name)/History</nowiki>) and add a link to it here using the <code>main</code> template. Be sure to reference text and sources by using <code><nowiki><ref></nowiki></code>, as well as adding them at the end of the article.''-->
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<!-- ''Examine the history of the creation and combat usage of the weapon in more detail than in the introduction. If the historical reference turns out to be too long, take it to a separate article, taking a link to the article about the weapon and adding a block "/History" (example: <nowiki>https://wiki.warthunder.com/(Weapon-name)/History</nowiki>) and add a link to it here using the <code>main</code> template. Be sure to reference text and sources by using <code><nowiki><ref></ref></nowiki></code>, as well as adding them at the end of the article with <code><nowiki><references /></nowiki></code>.'' -->
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The M85 is an American .50 cal heavy machine gun, which like the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)|Browning M2HB]] chambered the .50 BMG (12.7×99mm NATO) round. In 1951 the US army started a program to produce a new .50 cal machine gun for ground and tank applications, replacing the extensively used [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)|Browning M2HB]] machine gun in those roles. The new weapon would have to be lighter and more compact than the M2HB, have a better rate of fire, and require reduced maintenance. In early 1956 the General Electric T175 prototype was selected for further development (with work on other weapons stopped) and in 1959 the T175E2 was adopted for production as the M85.
+
The M85 is an American .50 cal heavy machine gun, which like the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)|Browning M2HB]] chambered the .50 BMG (12.7×99mm NATO) round. In 1951 the US army started a program to produce a new .50 cal machine gun for ground and tank applications, replacing the extensively used [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)|Browning M2HB]] machine gun in those roles. The new weapon would have to be lighter and more compact than the M2HB, have a better rate of fire, and require reduced maintenance. In early 1956 the General Electric T175 prototype was selected for further development (with work on other weapons stopped) and in 1959 the T175E2 was adopted for production as the M85.
  
−
The weapon was substantially smaller and lighter than the M2HB, and had a fixed head-space (removing the need for head-space adjustment, which was regularly required on the M2HB). Although the rate of fire was not substantially improved compared the M2HB, the M85 was able to switch below low and high fire rates, unlike the M2. The weapon was fitted predominantly on the M48 / M60 "Patton" series of tanks, as well as the LVTP-7 amphibious vehicle. Despite it's theoretical improvements over the M2 the M85 shared a similar fate to the [[M73 (7.62 mm)]] machine gun. In service the weapon proved to be extremely complex compared to the M2 and rapidly became unpopular with tank crews due to very poor reliability. Due to its poor reliability the M85 was not fitted to the new [[M1 Abrams]], and was eventually phased (as the M48 and M60 tanks left service). Ironically The M85 was replaced in service (on the LVTP-7 and M1 Abrams) by the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)|Browning M2HB]], the very weapon the M85 set out to replace.
+
The weapon was substantially smaller and lighter than the M2HB, and had a fixed head-space (removing the need for head-space adjustment, which was regularly required on the M2HB). Although the rate of fire was not substantially improved compared the M2HB, the M85 was able to switch between low and high rates of fire, unlike the M2. The weapon was fitted predominantly on the M48 / M60 "Patton" series of tanks, as well as the LVTP-7 amphibious vehicle. Despite its theoretical improvements over the M2, the M85 shared a similar fate to the [[M73 (7.62 mm)]] machine gun. In service the weapon proved to be extremely complex compared to the M2 and rapidly became unpopular with tank crews due to very poor reliability. Due to its poor reliability the M85 was not fitted to the new [[M1 Abrams]], and was eventually phased (as the M48 and M60 tanks left service). Ironically The M85 was replaced in service (on the LVTP-7 and M1 Abrams) by the [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)|Browning M2HB]], the very weapon the M85 set out to replace.
  
 
A version of the M85 was designed to replace the M2 in infantry use, and designated M85C. Like the original M85 it proved to be extremely unreliable and unpopular during testing and was never adopted.
 
A version of the M85 was designed to replace the M2 in infantry use, and designated M85C. Like the original M85 it proved to be extremely unreliable and unpopular during testing and was never adopted.
  
 
== Media ==
 
== Media ==
−
''An excellent addition to the article would be a video guide, as well as screenshots from the game and photos.''
+
<!-- ''Excellent additions to the article would be video guides, screenshots from the game, and photos.'' -->
 +
 
 +
;Images
 +
<gallery mode="packed-hover" heights="200">
 +
File:Weapon M85 12.7mm.jpg|<small>The M85 on the XM-1 (GM)</small>
 +
</gallery>
  
 
== See also ==
 
== See also ==
−
<!--''Links to the articles on the War Thunder Wiki that you think will be useful for the reader, for example:''
+
<!-- ''Links to the articles on the War Thunder Wiki that you think will be useful for the reader, for example:''
 
* ''reference to the article about the variant of the cannon/machine gun;''
 
* ''reference to the article about the variant of the cannon/machine gun;''
−
* ''references to approximate analogues by other nations and research trees.''-->
+
* ''references to approximate analogues by other nations and research trees.'' -->
 
* [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]]
 
* [[Browning M2HB (12.7 mm)]]
  
 
== External links ==
 
== External links ==
−
<!--''Paste links to sources and external resources, such as:''
+
<!-- ''Paste links to sources and external resources, such as:''
 
* ''topic on the official game forum;''
 
* ''topic on the official game forum;''
−
* ''encyclopedia page on weapon;''
+
* ''other literature.'' -->
−
* ''other literature.''-->
+
 
−
* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M85_machine_gun Wikipedia - M85 machine gun]
+
* [[wikipedia:M85_machine_gun|[Wikipedia] M85 machine gun]]
 
* [https://modernfirearms.net/en/machineguns/u-s-a-machineguns/m85-eng/ Modern Firearms - M85]
 
* [https://modernfirearms.net/en/machineguns/u-s-a-machineguns/m85-eng/ Modern Firearms - M85]
  

Latest revision as of 11:35, 20 August 2023

Introducing Wiki 3.0
The M85 on top of the XM-1 (GM)

Description

The M85 is an American .50 cal (12.7 mm) heavy machine gun. The machine gun is mainly found in place of the Browning M2HB (12.7 mm) machine gun, on some high rank American tanks (mainly as a commander's gun on the M48 and M60 Patton series). Being a 12.7 mm heavy machine gun the M85 has a reasonable amount of armour penetration, and higher damage output than medium and general purpose machine guns. This makes it much more effective at engaging weakly armoured enemy tanks, as well as aircraft.

Vehicles equipped with this weapon

Vehicles equipped with this weapon
Medium tanks  Magach 6A · M728 CEV · XM803
M60  M60 · M60A1 "D.C.Ariete" · M60A1 (AOS) · M60A1 RISE (P) · M60A2 · M60A3 TTS · ␗M60A3 TTS
XM-1  XM1 (Chrysler) · XM1 (GM)

General info

The M85 is a fairly standard 12.7 mm heavy machine gun. Despite being a completely separate weapon, it preforms almost completely identically to the much more widespread Browning M2HB (12.7 mm) heavy machine gun.

Available ammunition

The M85 can only be equipped with one ammo belt consisting of four M8 Armour-piercing incendiary (AP-I) bullets, followed by a single M20 Armour-piercing incendiary tracer bullet.

Default: AP-I · AP-I · AP-I · AP-I · API-T

Penetration statistics
Ammunition Penetration @ 0° Angle of Attack (mm)
10 m 100 m 500 m 1,000 m 1,500 m 2,000 m
AP-I 28 26 18 11 7 4
API-T 28 25 17 11 7 4
Shell details
Ammunition Velocity
(m/s) 		Projectile
mass (kg) 		Fuse delay Fuse sensitivity
(mm) 		Explosive mass
(TNT equivalent) (g) 		Ricochet
0% 50% 100%
AP-I 887 0.04 - - - 47° 56° 65°
API-T 887 0.04 - - - 47° 56° 65°

Comparison with analogues

The M85 performs functionally identically to the Browning M2HB (12.7 mm) machine gun found on most previous American tanks, as well as in other nation's tech tree. Like the M2HB it has a slightly lower rate of fire than other 12.7 mm machine guns, but has a larger belt capacity.

Usage in battles

Unlike lower calibre machine guns the M85 has enough penetration to be able to penetrate the armour of lightly armoured tanks (or the side / rear armour of some more heavily armoured tanks, bullets can also sometimes make it through armour holes such as the turret ring, or mg port of tanks, injuring crew members. Like all other machine guns it can be used for incapacitating exposed crew members, as well as marking enemy vehicles and obscuring the view of enemy players (shooting at their gun sight). It also does more damage to enemy aircraft than lower calibre machine guns, and is usually mounted on top of the turret, making aiming at aircraft much easier than with a co-axial gun. Clearing trees and bushes is another use.

Pros and cons

Pros:

  • Enough penetration to damage some enemy vehicles
  • Good belt capacity
  • Rate of fire is ok

Cons:

  • Slower rate of fire than Soviet 12.7 mm machine guns

History

The M85 is an American .50 cal heavy machine gun, which like the Browning M2HB chambered the .50 BMG (12.7×99mm NATO) round. In 1951 the US army started a program to produce a new .50 cal machine gun for ground and tank applications, replacing the extensively used Browning M2HB machine gun in those roles. The new weapon would have to be lighter and more compact than the M2HB, have a better rate of fire, and require reduced maintenance. In early 1956 the General Electric T175 prototype was selected for further development (with work on other weapons stopped) and in 1959 the T175E2 was adopted for production as the M85.

The weapon was substantially smaller and lighter than the M2HB, and had a fixed head-space (removing the need for head-space adjustment, which was regularly required on the M2HB). Although the rate of fire was not substantially improved compared the M2HB, the M85 was able to switch between low and high rates of fire, unlike the M2. The weapon was fitted predominantly on the M48 / M60 "Patton" series of tanks, as well as the LVTP-7 amphibious vehicle. Despite its theoretical improvements over the M2, the M85 shared a similar fate to the M73 (7.62 mm) machine gun. In service the weapon proved to be extremely complex compared to the M2 and rapidly became unpopular with tank crews due to very poor reliability. Due to its poor reliability the M85 was not fitted to the new M1 Abrams, and was eventually phased (as the M48 and M60 tanks left service). Ironically The M85 was replaced in service (on the LVTP-7 and M1 Abrams) by the Browning M2HB, the very weapon the M85 set out to replace.

A version of the M85 was designed to replace the M2 in infantry use, and designated M85C. Like the original M85 it proved to be extremely unreliable and unpopular during testing and was never adopted.

Media

Images

  • The M85 on the XM-1 (GM)

See also

External links


Tank machine guns
USA 
7.62 mm  M37 · M60D · M73 · M240 · M1919A4 · Mk.52
12.7 mm  FN M3P · M2HB · M80 · M85
Germany 
5.56 mm  MG4
7.62 mm  C6 · MG3A1
7.92 mm  MG13 Dreyse · MG34 · MG37(t) · MG42
12.7 mm  S.MG.50
USSR 
7.62 mm  DT · PKMB · PKT · PKTM · RP-46 · SGMT
12.7 mm  DK · DShK · 6P49 · NSVT
14.5 mm  KPVT
Britain 
7.62 mm  Browning MG4 · L3A1 · L8A1 · L8A2 · L37A1 · L37A2 · L94A1
7.7 mm  Vickers
7.92 mm  BESA
12.7 mm  L21A1
Japan 
6.5 mm  Type 91
7.62 mm  Type 74
7.7 mm  Type 97
12.7 mm  Type 60 (B)
China 
5.8 mm  QJT
7.62 mm  Type 55 · Type 59 · Type 86
12.7 mm  QJC88A · Type 54
14.5 mm  QJG02
Italy 
7.62 mm  Beretta MG42/59 · FN MAG 60-40
8 mm  34/40M · Breda Mod. 38
13.2 mm  Breda Model 31
France 
7.5 mm  AAT-52 · MAC 31
7.62 mm  A-A-F1N
8 mm  Hotchkiss Mle 1914
Sweden 
6.5 mm  ksp m/14-29
7.62 mm  ksp 39 C · ksp 58 · ksp 94
8 mm  ksp m/36 · ksp m/39B
12.7 mm  ksp 88

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