Difference between revisions of "SA35 L/72 (25 mm)"

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== Description ==
 
== Description ==
−
<!-- "Write an introduction to the article in 2-3 small paragraphs. Briefly tell us about the history of the development and combat using the weaponry and also about its features. Compile a list of air, ground, or naval vehicles that feature this weapon system in the game." -->
+
<!-- ''Write an introduction to the article in 2-3 small paragraphs. Briefly tell us about the history of the development and combat using the weaponry and also about its features. Compile a list of air, ground, or naval vehicles that feature this weapon system in the game.'' -->
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During the First World War, France together with Britain were the most important users and producers of armored cars. Starting from 1916, when France started to produce its first tanks, numerous studies were launched to properly understand armour and how to effectively defeat it, mainly so that the French troops had an easier time dealing with armored vehicles.  
+
During the First World War, France together with Britain were the most important users and producers of armoured cars. Starting from 1916, when France started to produce its first tanks, numerous studies were launched to properly understand armour and how to effectively defeat it, mainly so that the French troops had an easier time dealing with armoured vehicles.  
  
−
A great number of the 25 mm SA 34 cannons were developed in the 1930s to fulfill a variety of roles. A version used in armored vehicles existed, under the designation '''25 mm SA 35'''. This version of the gun was further shortened so that it could fit into smaller armored vehicles. This variant was then assigned the designation '''L/47.2''' instead of '''L/72'''.
+
A great number of the 25 mm SA 34 cannons were developed in the 1930s to fulfill a variety of roles. A version used in armoured vehicles existed, under the designation '''25 mm SA 35'''. This version of the gun was further shortened so that it could fit into smaller armoured vehicles. This variant was then assigned the designation '''L/47.2''' instead of '''L/72'''.
  
 
=== Vehicles equipped with this weapon ===
 
=== Vehicles equipped with this weapon ===
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== General info ==
 
== General info ==
−
<!-- "Tell us about the tactical and technical characteristics of the cannon or machine gun." -->
+
<!-- ''Tell us about the tactical and technical characteristics of the cannon or machine gun.'' -->
 
The SA34 L/72 is a cannon which takes shells of the 25 x 193.5 mm calibre, however only the APC round is available. Reload rate is 3.9 seconds, which translates to 15 rounds a minute. It has an effective range of 1,800 m. Length of the cannon is 1,800 mm.  
 
The SA34 L/72 is a cannon which takes shells of the 25 x 193.5 mm calibre, however only the APC round is available. Reload rate is 3.9 seconds, which translates to 15 rounds a minute. It has an effective range of 1,800 m. Length of the cannon is 1,800 mm.  
  
−
<!-- "Describe the shells that are available for the weapon and their features and purpose. If it concerns autocannons or machine guns, write about different ammo belts and what is inside (which types of shells)." -->* '''Mle1934 TP (Ch.F)'''
+
=== Available ammunition ===
 +
<!-- ''Describe the shells that are available for the weapon and their features and purpose. If it concerns autocannons or machine guns, write about different ammo belts and what is inside (which types of shells).'' -->
  
−
This is the only round available to the SA34. It is an APC round that relies on kinetic energy and spalling to cause damage to targets. Its mass is 310 g and the velocity of the round is roughly 950 m/s, which hits its target with the penetration power of up to 71 mm.
+
* '''Mle1934 TP (Ch.F)''': The only round available to the SA34 is an APC round that relies on kinetic energy and spalling to cause damage to targets.
 +
 
 +
{{:{{PAGENAME}}/Ammunition|Mle1934 TP (Ch.F)}}
  
 
=== Comparison with analogues ===
 
=== Comparison with analogues ===
−
<!-- "Give a comparative description of cannons/machine guns that have firepower equal to this weapon." -->
+
<!-- ''Give a comparative description of cannons/machine guns that have firepower equal to this weapon.'' -->
  
 
{| class="wikitable"
 
{| class="wikitable"
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!Ammunition
 
!Ammunition
 
!Maximum Penetration
 
!Maximum Penetration
−
|-
 
−
|▄
 
−
|[[Oerlikon KBA (25 mm)]]
 
−
|1970s
 
−
|_______
 
−
|600 - 700 RPM
 
−
|M792
 
−
M791
 
−
|81 mm
 
 
|-
 
|-
 
|▅
 
|▅
 
|[[25 mm/60 Type 96 (25 mm)]]
 
|[[25 mm/60 Type 96 (25 mm)]]
−
|1935
+
| 1935
−
|115 kg
+
| 115 kg
−
|220 - 260 RPM
+
| 220 - 260 RPM
−
|APT Belt
+
| APT Belt <br> HEIT Belt
−
HEIT Belt
+
| 55 mm
−
|55 mm
 
 
|}
 
|}
  
 
== Usage in battles ==
 
== Usage in battles ==
−
<!-- "Describe the cannon/machine gun in the game - its distinctive features, tactics of usage against notable opponents. Please don't write a "guide" - do not impose a single point of view, but give the reader food for thought." -->
+
<!-- ''Describe the cannon/machine gun in the game - its distinctive features, tactics of usage against notable opponents. Please don't write a "guide" - do not impose a single point of view, but give the reader food for thought.'' -->
−
Due to a low tier vehicle, a penetration value of 71 mm is sufficient enough to bring down most of the opposition you'll face. The velocity of 950 m/s will come in handy if one is trying to snipe, but it should be noted that penetration value drops drastically and even more so if one hits an angled piece of armor due to the subcaliber nature of the round.
+
Due to a low tier vehicle, a penetration value of 71 mm is sufficient enough to bring down most of the opposition you'll face. The velocity of 950 m/s will come in handy if one is trying to snipe, but the penetration value drops drastically and even more so if one hits an angled piece of armour due to the subcalibre nature of the round.
  
 
There are two main ways of using the SA34;
 
There are two main ways of using the SA34;
  
−
'''Flanking'''
+
;Flanking
  
 
If one is using the [[AMD.35]], speed allows for quick repositioning but also more importantly, huge flanking potential on some maps. The user can try to get around to the hostile team's sides or rear. Due to being an armoured car, protection is seriously lacking so one should avoid direct confrontation at all times. Taking out critical modules or crew mates such as the cannon or the gunner of the hostile vehicle is a sure way of killing an enemy rather quick. However, if one is playing against a vehicle that has access to .50 calibre machine guns, they should take extra precautions and disable it if necessary as a quick burst of it will destroy the user rather quick due to the AMD.35 only having 15 mm front and 10 mm side armour.
 
If one is using the [[AMD.35]], speed allows for quick repositioning but also more importantly, huge flanking potential on some maps. The user can try to get around to the hostile team's sides or rear. Due to being an armoured car, protection is seriously lacking so one should avoid direct confrontation at all times. Taking out critical modules or crew mates such as the cannon or the gunner of the hostile vehicle is a sure way of killing an enemy rather quick. However, if one is playing against a vehicle that has access to .50 calibre machine guns, they should take extra precautions and disable it if necessary as a quick burst of it will destroy the user rather quick due to the AMD.35 only having 15 mm front and 10 mm side armour.
  
−
'''Sniping'''
+
;Sniping
  
−
If one is using the [[AMR.35 ZT3]], it is highly recommended to not engage in direct confrontations but rather to find a good vantage point where the user can see most of the territory without exposing themselves all that much. The user lacks armour and they only have 2 crew mates, so protection and likelihood of surviving more than a single shot is highly unlikely. The armour is even worse than on the AMD.35 as the front and side armor is just 13 mm thick, while the rear is only 10 mm thick allowing even 7.62 mm bullets to penetrate and damage your engine or setting you ablaze.
+
If one is using the [[AMR.35 ZT3]], it is highly recommended to not engage in direct confrontations but rather to find a good vantage point where the user can see most of the territory without exposing themselves all that much. The user lacks armour and they only have 2 crew mates, so protection and likelihood of surviving more than a single shot is highly unlikely. The armour is even worse than on the AMD.35 as the front and side armour is just 13 mm thick, while the rear is only 10 mm thick allowing even 7.62 mm bullets to penetrate and damage your engine or setting you ablaze.
 
=== Pros and cons ===
 
=== Pros and cons ===
−
<!-- "Summarise and briefly evaluate the weaponry in terms of its characteristics and combat effectiveness. Mark pros and cons as a list."
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<!-- ''Summarise and briefly evaluate the weaponry in terms of its characteristics and combat effectiveness. Mark pros and cons as a list.'' -->
−
-->
 
  
 
'''Pros:'''
 
'''Pros:'''
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* Good penetration for a low tier French vehicle, being up to 71 mm
 
* Good penetration for a low tier French vehicle, being up to 71 mm
 
* Fast reload rate, only 3.9 seconds long
 
* Fast reload rate, only 3.9 seconds long
−
 
−
*
 
  
 
'''Cons:'''
 
'''Cons:'''
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* Creates below average spalling, one hit kills are inconsistent
 
* Creates below average spalling, one hit kills are inconsistent
 
* Can only carry 48 rounds in total
 
* Can only carry 48 rounds in total
−
 
−
*
 
  
 
== History ==
 
== History ==
−
<!-- "Examine the history of the creation and combat usage of the weapon in more detail than in the introduction. If the historical reference turns out to be too long, take it to a separate article, taking a link to the article about the weapon and adding a block "/History" (example: https://wiki.warthunder.com/(Weapon-name)/History) and add a link to it here using the main template. Be sure to reference text and sources by using <ref></ref>, as well as adding them at the end of the article with <references />." -->
+
<!-- ''Examine the history of the creation and combat usage of the weapon in more detail than in the introduction. If the historical reference turns out to be too long, take it to a separate article, taking a link to the article about the weapon and adding a block "/History" (example: https://wiki.warthunder.com/(Weapon-name)/History) and add a link to it here using the main template. Be sure to reference text and sources by using <ref></ref>, as well as adding them at the end of the article with <references />.'' -->
−
In the last two years of the First World War a '''French Chef''' '''d’escadrons''' (Chief of squadrons) '''Filloux''', designed some light, high-velocity anti-tank weapons. Those being the 13 mm and a 17 mm anti-tank guns, with the latter being able to be mounted on carriage of the standard 37 mm SA 16 infantry support gun. While studies of the 17 mm anti-tank guns stopped with the conclusion of the First World War, they set a precedent for the concept of small, high-velocity anti-tank guns in the French military.
+
In the last two years of the First World War a French Chef d'escadrons (Chief of squadrons), Filloux, designed some light, high-velocity anti-tank weapons. Those being the 13 mm and a 17 mm anti-tank guns, with the latter being able to be mounted on carriage of the standard 37 mm SA 16 infantry support gun. While studies of the 17 mm anti-tank guns stopped with the conclusion of the First World War, they set a precedent for the concept of small, high-velocity anti-tank guns in the French military.
  
−
With the studies of the Filloux anti-tank rifle and gun discontinued, and similar anti-tank projects such as Delaunay-Belleville’s 20 mm “anti-tank machine-gun” remaining at prototype stage, the French Army had to rely on the '''37 mm''' '''TR SA 16''' gun to defeat enemy armor. From this gun, the '''FT's 37 mm SA 18''' gun was derived, however it was quickly proved to be highly inadequate against an army with vast amounts of armored vehicles.
+
With the studies of the Filloux anti-tank rifle and gun discontinued, and similar anti-tank projects such as Delaunay-Belleville's 20 mm anti-tank machine-gun remaining at prototype stage, the French Army had to rely on the 37 mm TR SA 16 gun to defeat enemy armour. From this gun, the FT's 37 mm SA18 gun was derived, however it was quickly proved to be highly inadequate against an army with vast amounts of armoured vehicles.
  
−
'''Hotchkiss''', a giant of the French industry particularly when it came to light artillery pieces, offered an anti-tank gun to the French military as early as 1926, however it was not immediately adopted. The French Army waited until 1934, after extensive trials and perhaps out of fear caused by the rise of the Nazis in Germany to adopt Hotchkiss's gun.
+
Hotchkiss, a giant of the French industry particularly when it came to light artillery pieces, offered an anti-tank gun to the French military as early as 1926, however it was not immediately adopted. The French Army waited until 1934, after extensive trials and perhaps out of fear caused by the rise of the Nazis in Germany to adopt Hotchkiss' gun.
  
−
Hotchkiss’s anti-tank gun was a low-caliber one, even for the era. While most anti-tank guns of the 1930s exceeded 37 mm, the SA 34 fired 25 × 193.5 mm rimmed projectiles, which the French documents refer to as cartridges instead of shells. The gun had a 1,800 mm, 72-calibers long barrel, resulting in a high muzzle velocity of 950 m/s.
+
Hotchkiss' anti-tank gun was a low-calibre one, even for the era. While most anti-tank guns of the 1930s exceeded 37 mm, the SA 34 fired 25 × 193.5 mm rimmed projectiles, which the French documents refer to as cartridges instead of shells. The gun had a 1,800 mm, 72-calibres long barrel, resulting in a high muzzle velocity of 950 m/s.
  
−
While the main purpose of this gun was to be mounted on carriage, which allowed the French troops to carry it with them, it also served well when it was attached to lightly armoured vehicles, such as the AMD. 35. Many variants were derived from the SA34, such as the '''SA35''' or even the '''SA-L 37'''.
+
While the main purpose of this gun was to be mounted on a carriage, which allowed the French troops to carry it with them, it also served well when it was attached to lightly armoured vehicles, such as the AMD. 35. Many variants were derived from the SA34, such as the '''SA35''' or even the '''SA-L 37'''.
  
 
== Media ==
 
== Media ==
−
<!-- "An excellent addition to the article would be a video guide, as well as screenshots from the game and photos." -->[[File:GarageImage AMR.35 ZT3.jpg|none|thumb|SA34 L/72 mounted on an AMR.35 ZT3]]
+
<!-- ''Excellent additions to the article would be video guides, screenshots from the game, and photos.'' -->
 +
 
 +
;Images
 +
<gallery mode="packed-hover" heights="200">
 +
File:GarageImage AMR.35 ZT3.jpg|<small>SA34 L/72 mounted on an AMR.35 ZT3</small>
 +
</gallery>
  
 
== See also ==
 
== See also ==
−
<!-- "Links to the articles on the War Thunder Wiki that you think will be useful for the reader, for example:"
+
<!-- ''Links to the articles on the War Thunder Wiki that you think will be useful for the reader, for example:''
 +
* ''reference to the article about the variant of the cannon/machine gun;''
 +
* ''references to approximate analogues by other nations and research trees.'' -->
  
−
* "reference to the article about the variant of the cannon/machine gun;"
 
−
 
−
* "references to approximate analogues by other nations and research trees." -->
 
−
 
−
* [[Oerlikon KBA (25 mm)]] - Italian 25 mm autocannon
 
 
* [[25 mm/60 Type 96 (25 mm)]] - Japanese naval anti-aircraft cannon
 
* [[25 mm/60 Type 96 (25 mm)]] - Japanese naval anti-aircraft cannon
  
 
== External links ==
 
== External links ==
−
<!-- "Paste links to sources and external resources, such as:"
+
<!-- ''Paste links to sources and external resources, such as:''
−
 
+
* ''topic on the official game forum;''
−
* "topic on the official game forum;"
+
* ''other literature.'' -->
−
* "encyclopedia page on the weapon;"
 
−
* "other literature." -->
 
  
−
* [https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2-france-canon-de-25mm-semi-automatique-modele-1934/ <nowiki>[Tanks Encyclopedia] Canon De 25 mm</nowiki>]
+
* [[wikipedia:25_mm_Hotchkiss_anti-tank_gun|[Wikipedia] 25 mm Hotchkiss anti-tank gun]]
−
* [https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canon_l%C3%A9ger_de_25_antichar_SA-L_mod%C3%A8le_1934 <nowiki>[Wikipedia.fr] 25 mm SA 34</nowiki>]  
+
* [https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2-france-canon-de-25mm-semi-automatique-modele-1934/ <nowiki>[Tanks Encyclopedia]</nowiki> Canon de 25mm Semi-Automatique Modèle 1934 (25mm SA 34)]
  
 
{{France tank cannons}}
 
{{France tank cannons}}
−
 
 
[[Category:Tank cannons]]
 
[[Category:Tank cannons]]

Latest revision as of 22:10, 22 January 2023

Description

During the First World War, France together with Britain were the most important users and producers of armoured cars. Starting from 1916, when France started to produce its first tanks, numerous studies were launched to properly understand armour and how to effectively defeat it, mainly so that the French troops had an easier time dealing with armoured vehicles.

A great number of the 25 mm SA 34 cannons were developed in the 1930s to fulfill a variety of roles. A version used in armoured vehicles existed, under the designation 25 mm SA 35. This version of the gun was further shortened so that it could fit into smaller armoured vehicles. This variant was then assigned the designation L/47.2 instead of L/72.

Vehicles equipped with this weapon

General info

The SA34 L/72 is a cannon which takes shells of the 25 x 193.5 mm calibre, however only the APC round is available. Reload rate is 3.9 seconds, which translates to 15 rounds a minute. It has an effective range of 1,800 m. Length of the cannon is 1,800 mm.

Available ammunition

  • Mle1934 TP (Ch.F): The only round available to the SA34 is an APC round that relies on kinetic energy and spalling to cause damage to targets.

Penetration statistics
Ammunition Type of
warhead 		Penetration @ 0° Angle of Attack (mm)
10 m 100 m 500 m 1,000 m 1,500 m 2,000 m
Mle1934 TP (Ch.F) APC 71 68 56 44 34 27
Shell details
Ammunition Type of
warhead 		Velocity
(m/s) 		Projectile
mass (kg) 		Fuse delay Fuse sensitivity
(mm) 		Explosive mass
(TNT equivalent) (g) 		Ricochet
0% 50% 100%
Mle1934 TP (Ch.F) APC 950 0.31 - - - 48° 63° 71°

Comparison with analogues

Cannons comparable to SA34 L/72
Name Year of Creation Mass Rounds Per Minute Ammunition Maximum Penetration
▅ 25 mm/60 Type 96 (25 mm) 1935 115 kg 220 - 260 RPM APT Belt
HEIT Belt 		55 mm

Usage in battles

Due to a low tier vehicle, a penetration value of 71 mm is sufficient enough to bring down most of the opposition you'll face. The velocity of 950 m/s will come in handy if one is trying to snipe, but the penetration value drops drastically and even more so if one hits an angled piece of armour due to the subcalibre nature of the round.

There are two main ways of using the SA34;

Flanking

If one is using the AMD.35, speed allows for quick repositioning but also more importantly, huge flanking potential on some maps. The user can try to get around to the hostile team's sides or rear. Due to being an armoured car, protection is seriously lacking so one should avoid direct confrontation at all times. Taking out critical modules or crew mates such as the cannon or the gunner of the hostile vehicle is a sure way of killing an enemy rather quick. However, if one is playing against a vehicle that has access to .50 calibre machine guns, they should take extra precautions and disable it if necessary as a quick burst of it will destroy the user rather quick due to the AMD.35 only having 15 mm front and 10 mm side armour.

Sniping

If one is using the AMR.35 ZT3, it is highly recommended to not engage in direct confrontations but rather to find a good vantage point where the user can see most of the territory without exposing themselves all that much. The user lacks armour and they only have 2 crew mates, so protection and likelihood of surviving more than a single shot is highly unlikely. The armour is even worse than on the AMD.35 as the front and side armour is just 13 mm thick, while the rear is only 10 mm thick allowing even 7.62 mm bullets to penetrate and damage your engine or setting you ablaze.

Pros and cons

Pros:

  • High velocity, clocking in at 950 m/s
  • Good penetration for a low tier French vehicle, being up to 71 mm
  • Fast reload rate, only 3.9 seconds long

Cons:

  • Only has access to the APC subcalibre round, which might be inconsistent at longer ranges or when facing sloped armour
  • Creates below average spalling, one hit kills are inconsistent
  • Can only carry 48 rounds in total

History

In the last two years of the First World War a French Chef d'escadrons (Chief of squadrons), Filloux, designed some light, high-velocity anti-tank weapons. Those being the 13 mm and a 17 mm anti-tank guns, with the latter being able to be mounted on carriage of the standard 37 mm SA 16 infantry support gun. While studies of the 17 mm anti-tank guns stopped with the conclusion of the First World War, they set a precedent for the concept of small, high-velocity anti-tank guns in the French military.

With the studies of the Filloux anti-tank rifle and gun discontinued, and similar anti-tank projects such as Delaunay-Belleville's 20 mm anti-tank machine-gun remaining at prototype stage, the French Army had to rely on the 37 mm TR SA 16 gun to defeat enemy armour. From this gun, the FT's 37 mm SA18 gun was derived, however it was quickly proved to be highly inadequate against an army with vast amounts of armoured vehicles.

Hotchkiss, a giant of the French industry particularly when it came to light artillery pieces, offered an anti-tank gun to the French military as early as 1926, however it was not immediately adopted. The French Army waited until 1934, after extensive trials and perhaps out of fear caused by the rise of the Nazis in Germany to adopt Hotchkiss' gun.

Hotchkiss' anti-tank gun was a low-calibre one, even for the era. While most anti-tank guns of the 1930s exceeded 37 mm, the SA 34 fired 25 × 193.5 mm rimmed projectiles, which the French documents refer to as cartridges instead of shells. The gun had a 1,800 mm, 72-calibres long barrel, resulting in a high muzzle velocity of 950 m/s.

While the main purpose of this gun was to be mounted on a carriage, which allowed the French troops to carry it with them, it also served well when it was attached to lightly armoured vehicles, such as the AMD. 35. Many variants were derived from the SA34, such as the SA35 or even the SA-L 37.

Media

Images

  • SA34 L/72 mounted on an AMR.35 ZT3

See also

External links


France tank cannons
20 mm  20F2
25 mm  SA35 L/72
37 mm  SA18 L/21 · SA38 L/33
47 mm  SA34 L/30 · SA35 L/32 · SA37
75 mm  APX · APX Canon de 75 mm modèle 1897 · SA35 L/17 · SA44 · SA49 · SA50 L/57
90 mm  D.911 APX · CN90 F2 · CN90 F3 · CN90 F4 · D915 · DEFA F1 · SA45 · SA47
100 mm  SA47 L/58
105 mm  CN-105-F1 · Giat 105 G2 · Modele F2 · PzK M57
120 mm  GIAT CN120-25 G1 · GIAT CN120-26 F1 · SA46
142 mm  ACRA
155 mm  GCT F1 · Schneider 155 C · L'Obusier de 155 Modèle 1950
  Foreign:
15 mm  MG 151 (Germany)
20 mm  MG 151 (Germany)
30 mm  Bushmaster 2 Mk.44 (USA)
37 mm  M6 (USA)
40 mm  Bofors L/60 · QF 2-pounder (Britain)
75 mm  KwK42 (Germany) · M3 (USA) · M6 (USA)
76 mm  M7 (USA)
90 mm  M3 (USA)
105 mm  M4 (USA)

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