User:U42773747 - Revision history

U42773747 at 22:31, 20 November 2024

2024-11-20T22:31:29Z

U42773747: /* links to remember */ adding flap page here just so i don't forget it exists in some time. Unless you would add optics and this to main pages of corresponding army branches as they are finalized? One can dream i guess.

2024-06-04T19:05:36Z

‎links to remember: adding flap page here just so i don't forget it exists in some time. Unless you would add optics and this to main pages of corresponding army branches as they are finalized? One can dream i guess.

U42773747: /* Ground forces missile power comparison checklist */

2022-08-21T19:25:23Z

‎Ground forces missile power comparison checklist

U42773747: Drafted comparison guideline for ATGM tanks, maybe someone will find this useful or update ATGM page with it, idk. I didn't bother writing in 3 separate places that already has similar information just to have it all in same place for convenience.

2022-08-21T19:02:24Z

Drafted comparison guideline for ATGM tanks, maybe someone will find this useful or update ATGM page with it, idk. I didn't bother writing in 3 separate places that already has similar information just to have it all in same place for convenience.

U38088265: Undo revision 134496 by U42773747 (talk)

2022-08-08T14:58:11Z

Undo revision 134496 by U42773747 (talk)

Can't load revision 134498

U42773747: New ATGM technique. But very buggy and unsportsman-like.

2022-08-08T12:31:09Z

New ATGM technique. But very buggy and unsportsman-like.

Can't load revision 134496

U42773747: /* Who am I? */ consider this my resignation.

2021-07-04T13:26:51Z

‎Who am I?: consider this my resignation.

U42773747: /* Hull down and other cover related items */ ....

2021-01-27T09:25:37Z

‎Hull down and other cover related items: ....

U42773747: The icon was here for amusement and science reasons anyway. I don't mind and will probably look at how it was re-made later. Though, i never really played in 2016, so probably 2018 is more accurate. (i still have "brother in arms" though, lol)

2021-01-25T10:42:23Z

The icon was here for amusement and science reasons anyway. I don't mind and will probably look at how it was re-made later. Though, i never really played in 2016, so probably 2018 is more accurate. (i still have "brother in arms" though, lol)

U17577377: Rabbitholed Adding Userboxes After Giving The Guy A Better Arty.Icon (Let Page-User Decide If It's Ok Before Approving Page)

2021-01-22T16:18:07Z

Rabbitholed Adding Userboxes After Giving The Guy A Better Arty.Icon (Let Page-User Decide If It's Ok Before Approving Page)

@@ Line 26: / Line 26: @@
 == Who am I? ==
-I'm a British ground forces main, registered my account at 2016, but really started playing in 2018. Mostly playing in AB, since I feel like vehicles there have most balanced stats game-wise there, if you forget about wallhack and aim assist up to 1 km range. If not for those two facts, I'd never ever leave AB, lol. Actually, either of these options on their own would be fine, but together it's is a bit too much sometimes.
+I'm a British ground forces main, registered my account at 2016, but really started playing in 2018. Mostly playing in AB, since I feel like vehicles there have most balanced stats game-wise there, if you forget about wallhack and aim assist. 8.3-9 are probably mine favourite BRs.
 If to not consider factions, i mostly use SPG and light tanks (including combat SPAA) and specialize in ATGM vehicles in particular. I dislike using medium tanks, due to them being flawed cannon fodder for no benefit, with very few exceptions. I like the idea of heavy tanks, but factions i play only have ridicilously flawed ones (to a point even 0.3 uptier means certain death even at 45 degree angle frontally), so i do not use them very often.
-I do have some planes, but i practically do not play air mode. Bombers that I used are very moody mistresses, they have gunners that either destroy every fighter in 360 degrees and on max range, or do nothing. Hurricane MK IIB/trop and Nimrod II so far left the best impression on me, and so I mostly prefer sea fighters over anything else.
+I do have some planes, but i practically do not play air mode. I did reach top tier, but it feels boring to me, as attacker playstyle is not relevant there past 4.0, as games end before you can do any significant team score damage (yes, i actually prefer to attack tanks rather than bases). The planes randomly being completely changed also didn't help my opinion much. The recent release of brimstone without fire-and-forget feature even for air mode in top tier just says it all, really.
-If you have issues with what i write, i mostly operate from game perspective and what i saw or did in it. I also accepted that i have to plaster a lot of pictures around, due to my texts often sounding like crazy talk. History does not interest me and might as well not exist, unless i am forced to write in certain style.
+If you have issues with what i write, i mostly operate from game perspective and what i actually saw or did in it. I also accepted that i have to plaster a lot of pictures around, due to my texts often sounding like crazy talk. History does not interest me and might as well not exist, unless i am forced to write in certain style.
 I do not mind if someone overrides and even deletes mine walls of text either, as long as new informations is not false, so don't worry about that. It is inevitable due to amount of stealth patches going on.
-I am gone, so if someone would log on and pretend to be me, it's an impostor.
+Some people thought that i'm a part of WSP or something, i am not and i never was.
 ===Favorite ground vehicles so far===
@@ Line 50: / Line 50: @@
 [[Centurion Mk 1]] - After playing with other nation, I can see how it's alright. It can bounce enemy shot when cutting a corner, then fire back at them and go on with it's business. And it's not terribly overtiered, like the rest of its tech line, so it can actually survive.
-Radar SPAA in general - Since the lock-on update playing such SPAA became a bliss. As British player I mostly use [[Chieftain Marksman|Marksman]] right now, which can incinerate every light vehicle in 2km range on top of shredding anything that flies. It also generates hatemails like crazy, since people underestimate it due to it's snail speed and ridiculous size. In 10.0 there is [[Stormer HVM]], which is very whimsical, but removes anything that flies next to instantly.
+Radar SPAA in general - Since the lock-on update playing such SPAA became a bliss. As British player I mostly use [[Chieftain Marksman|Marksman]] , which can incinerate every light vehicle in 2km range on top of shredding anything that flies. It also generates hatemails like crazy, since people underestimate it due to it's snail speed and ridiculous size. In 10.0 there is [[Stormer HVM]], which is very whimsical, but removes anything that flies next to instantly.
 [[Warrior|All]] [[Swingfire|British]] [[Striker|ATGMs]] - That feeling when people just despair and give up in their own cover under ATGM rain is priceless. They launch up to 10 artys at once on you and entire sniper gangs try to get you the entire match. It makes you feel special, even if you do die from it.
@@ Line 56: / Line 56: @@
 [[File:Striker LastStandStrike.jpg|thumb|oh god why]]
-japan?
+Japan?
 [[Chi-Ha Kai]] - the first tank in jap line that doesn't need HEAT to defeat something. It also has decent control. Can be used to steadily break enemy, at least in successive 1v1 duels. Massive rush will obliterate it. Actually, every tank after this one is mostly alright, though mostly its like this: glass cannon->tank that can actually bounce-> glass cannon -> tank that can actually bounce. Chi-to and Chi-to late are the most obvious successors of chi-ha kai and example of this rotation.
@@ Line 69: / Line 69: @@
 [[Type 75 SPH]] - while the gun depression and suspension on this is worth a potato, it can just fire over hills and special proximity fuse shell will get you even behind a wall, even if you are an indirect ATGM god and never show yourself. Might as well J-out, because if you didn't explode on first hit, it will fire again in 10 seconds due to fully automatic autoloader and incinirate your tank for good.
 === Hated ground vehicles so far ===
@@ Line 79: / Line 85: @@
 [[Na-To]] - I feel like this tank is a failure on it's BR. Not only it's open topped again (after [[Ho-Ni III]]), but it reminds people of [[8,8 cm Flak 37 Sfl.|flakbus]], and so it will trigger every person in 2km range to attack you until this truck is annihilated, which happens a lot faster, because it doesn't have flakbus armour or spacious crew placement. One can even one-shot it with APHE, if they know how. You may also expect to use it in up-tier with APCR, but it's penetration is just not good enough for frontal shot. If to compare it to other vehicles at rank, [[90/53 M41M]] creates such a horror effect to anyone who ever was shot by it, it doesn't even need any protection, not to mention it's much more resistant to damage.
 === Archnemesis ===

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:05, 4 June 2024
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	Link to optics gallery: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Optics		Link to optics gallery: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Optics
		+
		+	Link to autoflaps page: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Automatic_flaps

	Link to nvd page: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Night_Vision_Devices		Link to nvd page: https://wiki.warthunder.com/Night_Vision_Devices

@@ Line 135: / Line 135: @@
 * Roof mounted horizontal - Missile is generally mounted on a roof and launched forward by "fire '''special''' weapon" button. Problems come from the launcher being a liability (very easy to hit with HE or spot in general before you can even use them, very poor launcher depression, etc). These launchers also have a safety catch installed in them which '''prevents tanks from firing at point blank range to various degree'''. In AB, Light tanks are usually allowed to resupply this launcher without coming to the capture point.
-**Horizontally launched missiles have different starting speeds. Generally its 80% of maximum speed, or just maximum speed (like with [[BMP-2]], but it might also be 50% (like with the [[Warrior]]), obviously, the faster is the missile from the get-go, the more useful it is in general melee and in a hill battles, but also less useful when fighting over a flat plain (as it will just leave your LOS before you can correct it).
+**Horizontally launched missiles have different starting speeds. Generally its 80% of maximum speed, or just maximum speed (like with [[BMP-2]]), but it might also be 50% (like with the [[Warrior]] firing downwards), obviously, the faster is the missile from the get-go, the more useful it is in general melee and in a hill battles, but also less useful when fighting over a flat plain (as it will just leave your LOS before you can correct it).
 * Horizontal launcher - Can launch missile up or forward from a specialized launcher or cannon. They are launched by "fire '''primary''' weapon" button. Generally, even more of a liability than the roof strapped ATGM, because in the case of these tanks sometimes the launcher ammo rack counts as an instant-kill hazard. But they also have benefits, for example they can be fired at any range, even if it kills the ATGM carrier by exploding enemy tank in its face.
 ** Missile are immediately controllable after launch, so no waiting to get missile controls back. But this also means you can't just launch the missile behind a hill and expect it to hit tanks without an effort, you have to do all of it yourself.
 ** These launchers have even more variety of launch missile speed. It may vary from 100% (like with the [[BMD-4]] and [[Khrizantema-S]]) to 0% (like with the [[M551]]) speed. Slow launch missiles cannot be used as an opener, but are easier to launch behind a building.
-** Some tanks fire ATGM with their cannon. '''All of them''' can fire on the move by default. Usually they receive an insane ATGM reload penalties compared to the tank shells (generally almost threefold) and are uncompetetive at close range with other ATGM carriers. These tanks can be successfully used even if the gun barrel got broken (the ATGM does not receive damage penalty and does not get randomly launched wherever even if you don't fully repair the barrel), and ATGM are often used as an opener (especially tandem charge missiles)
+** Some tanks fire ATGM with their cannon. '''All of them''' can fire on the move by default. Usually they receive an insane ATGM reload penalties compared to the tank shells (generally almost threefold) and are uncompetetive at close range with other ATGM carriers. These tanks can be successfully used even if the gun barrel got broken (the ATGM does not receive damage penalty and does not get randomly launched wherever even if you don't fully repair the barrel), and ATGM are often used as an opener (especially tandem charge missiles).
 '''Attack type:'''

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:02, 21 August 2022
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	[[File:Before_camera_adjustment.jpg\|240x240px]][[File:After_camera_adjustment.jpg\|240x240px\|center\|after.]]		[[File:Before_camera_adjustment.jpg\|240x240px]][[File:After_camera_adjustment.jpg\|240x240px\|center\|after.]]
		+
		+	== Ground forces missile power comparison checklist ==
		+
		+	A list of stats to pay attention to/ to make educated guesses from. Mostly ground forces perspective. The rules apply to manually guided SAM and ATGM.
		+
		+	'''Guidance type''':
		+
		+	* Hand aiming (manual) - in RB, forces tank to stop and is guided with WASD (tank controls). in AB it is replaced with semi-auto (no ECCM) by default.
		+	**Context: To see if it's bad or not, check when the missile starts to actually respond to commands (after how many meters), and how responsive they are.
		+	**Difference between the RB and AB for tanks with manual aim is that in AB the tank might be restricted to only aim with sniper crosshairs (like [[type 60 ATM]] or [[RakJPz 2]] after recent nerf), which is very bad as usually in AB ATGM tanks are allowed to aim anywhere (like the [[Zachlam Tager]] currently), as to avoid being killed by tanks with Aim Assist. Otherwise it is clunky.
		+	**Hand aimed ATGM can be controlled outside of LOS in RB, which makes them decent for artillery strikes (see "launch type").
		+
		+	* Semi-Automatic (SACLOS, 2nd gen, etc.) - The tank guides the missile with IR light and it is controlled by mouse. '''If it does not have ECCM it can be jammed''' (check right under "guidance system type" in stat-card). It will never trigger LWS. If the tank cannot see the missile, the control is lost. Only one can be guided at once.
		+	**Context: Some tanks, even in RB, can guide missiles past sniper crosshairs, but you can't guide missile after it left your LOS. Therefore, in ATGM battle the best missile tank has the ability to guide with it's launcher located as high as possible, or the scope on the very roof, and the missile controls for it are very lenient. For comparison, [[BMP-2]] theoretically can fire ATGM over a wall, as it pokes out, but it cannot aim it, and, most likely its safety catch will prevent it from firing in the first place. [[Shturm-S]] can (whether it's a bug or not), swap controls to launcher itself and fire directly over a wall and it will be able to guide (in rb only at melee range). [[IT-1]] does this by default in AB/RB.
		+	**Some SACLOS missiles immediately drop to the ground if you cut them off by launching next missile. This is very important as it would be very convenient to just spray a fan of missiles and retreat to cover without actually guiding them. This also affects "manually guided" missiles in AB.
		+	**Jamming actually does not occur to '''direct attack''' missiles if your missile is out of your LOS. Tanks with optics on top and super agile missiles like the [[Shturm-S]] can launch the missile and just back off immediately to ignore the jamming altogether.
		+	**Generally, if the tank has "commander aim" functionality, he also can guide missiles, thus increasing tank's LOS capability by moving the guidance device from gunner scope to the tank roof, so ATGM tanks with that function should turn it on by default before engaging. Simply having Commander optics '''does not''' imply that he can aim ATGM.
		+
		+	* Beam riding (laser guided) - The tank guides missiles with laser beam. It is allowed to launch and guide all of them together. It cannot be jammed or interfered with in any way as of now. However, if after a launch you will aim directly at enemy tank or helicopter that has LWS, it will receive attack alert.
		+	**Context: Semi-automatic [[Striker]] and [[MEPHISTO]] may have a lot of missile pods, but they are constantly exposed and can't really utilise missiles that are still mounted. [[ZT3A2]] with laser guidance does not have this problem - theoretically you just launch all 3 missiles and then even if people hit the missile rack, it is already empty, so it's irrelevant unless HE was used (currently, the ammo rack of that tank almost constantly counts as an active ammo rack, even when empty for some reason, so pay attention to stealth-nerfs).
		+	**There isn't that many LWS armed tanks besides the majority of italian and japanese tanks of 9.0+, but it's better to not aim directly at the enemy until the missiles are close to them. Since helicopters can spam multiple "Hellfires" or "vikhrs" and rely on laser lock to attack the tanks while manoeuvering, these tankers will immediately drop smokes (to break the lock-on) and move, or even try to shoot back.
		+
		+	'''Launch type:'''
		+
		+	* Vertical (fixed) - Missile is launched upwards, then comes back on course after certain distance (usually 150m or 240 m). The key is to find out where enemy tank really is, then aim sniper scope exactly there, then launch, the missile does the rest by itself. If it doesn't, you can pull out of cover and aim at the enemy tank to finish the job (or just steer them around if they are hand aimed).
		+	**SACLOS missiles have a tendency to fail at doing full hulldown strategy, as missiles tend to deviate by 5 degrees eventually, but the tanks that have them usually have raised optics, thus should be difficult to destroy with HEAT while they correct the shot. This can be a problem in AB, where manual aim is replaced with SACLOS on tanks that aren't built do to this.
		+	**To fire straight, such tank must angle itself down about 30 degrees, or at least until aiming applications for the launchers become visible. (then the missile simply flies into crosshairs)
		+
		+	* Roof mounted horizontal - Missile is generally mounted on a roof and launched forward by "fire '''special''' weapon" button. Problems come from the launcher being a liability (very easy to hit with HE or spot in general before you can even use them, very poor launcher depression, etc). These launchers also have a safety catch installed in them which '''prevents tanks from firing at point blank range to various degree'''. In AB, Light tanks are usually allowed to resupply this launcher without coming to the capture point.
		+	**Horizontally launched missiles have different starting speeds. Generally its 80% of maximum speed, or just maximum speed (like with [[BMP-2]], but it might also be 50% (like with the [[Warrior]]), obviously, the faster is the missile from the get-go, the more useful it is in general melee and in a hill battles, but also less useful when fighting over a flat plain (as it will just leave your LOS before you can correct it).
		+
		+	* Horizontal launcher - Can launch missile up or forward from a specialized launcher or cannon. They are launched by "fire '''primary''' weapon" button. Generally, even more of a liability than the roof strapped ATGM, because in the case of these tanks sometimes the launcher ammo rack counts as an instant-kill hazard. But they also have benefits, for example they can be fired at any range, even if it kills the ATGM carrier by exploding enemy tank in its face.
		+	** Missile are immediately controllable after launch, so no waiting to get missile controls back. But this also means you can't just launch the missile behind a hill and expect it to hit tanks without an effort, you have to do all of it yourself.
		+	** These launchers have even more variety of launch missile speed. It may vary from 100% (like with the [[BMD-4]] and [[Khrizantema-S]]) to 0% (like with the [[M551]]) speed. Slow launch missiles cannot be used as an opener, but are easier to launch behind a building.
		+	** Some tanks fire ATGM with their cannon. '''All of them''' can fire on the move by default. Usually they receive an insane ATGM reload penalties compared to the tank shells (generally almost threefold) and are uncompetetive at close range with other ATGM carriers. These tanks can be successfully used even if the gun barrel got broken (the ATGM does not receive damage penalty and does not get randomly launched wherever even if you don't fully repair the barrel), and ATGM are often used as an opener (especially tandem charge missiles)
		+
		+	'''Attack type:'''
		+
		+	* Direct hit - Aim ATGM at the tank, it flies into it and explodes, simple enough. Cover can block them, but user can launch them from above or just guide them into cover at the last moment.
		+	* Top-down - When you aim crosshairs at something, it flies approximately 10 degrees above that and tries to spot tanks. If there is anything "tank-like" below them, they explode downwards. They react to dead tanks and may detonate too early if enemy tank has the turret on the very back. If it does not have ECCM, '''it can be jammed even if enemy tank can't see you'''. Can be used to directly hit tanks, but generally can't do much if used that way due to a reduced penetration power.
		+
		+	'''Payload type:'''
		+
		+	*HEAT - Much like HEAT shells, it does punctual damage in direction of a hit. ATGM is stronger than shells, because you can control the damage cone direction, and it in general has enough penetration to ignore internal defences. The more explosive mass the ATGM has, the more likely it is to one shot tanks by destroying fuel tanks and the more AOE it has after penetration.
		+	**Usually does 15 mm RHA of overpressure damage, '''but there are exceptions''', particularly if missiles have more than 3 kg explosive mass (in TNT eq). Explosive mass does not always equal to more damage, but always equal to more overpressure range.
		+	*HEAT (tandem) - Ignores ERA of a tank (the hit is calculated as if it was not present).
		+	**It appears that they do around 30 mm RHA of overpressure damage on initial hit by default, but it might not be the case with [[ZBD86]] (i have no way to test this).
		+	*HE - Basically an HE shell strapped to a missile. The same overpressure rules apply to the ATGM and it might also come with proximity fuse that only reacts to aircraft (HE-VT, like [[Shturm-S]] or [[BMP-2M]]) or have top-down attack ability (like with [[type 89]])

	==links to remember==		==links to remember==

@@ Line 36: / Line 36: @@
 I do not mind if someone overrides and even deletes mine walls of text either, as long as new informations is not false, so don't worry about that. It is inevitable due to amount of stealth patches going on.
-Currently inactive and writing using common sense/patch notes if at all.
+I am gone, so if someone would log on and pretend to be me, it's an impostor.
 ===Favorite ground vehicles so far===

@@ Line 1,342: / Line 1,342: @@
 ==Hull down and other cover related items==
-{{Notice| Biased opinions of AB player. Probably wont work for RB, incomplete for most tanks.|!}}
+{{Notice| Biased opinions of AB player. Probably wont work for RB, incomplete for most tanks. Concepts which may need testing are locked into << >> |!}}
 ===Cover levels and height of tanks necessary to use them===
@@ Line 1,351: / Line 1,351: @@
 * Generic dead tank decoration (indestructible)
 * Generic short stone (indestructible)
-* Building wall and windows (indestructible, usually anyway)
+* Building wall and windows ('''usually''' indestructible)
 * Tall rocks (indestructible)
 * Tall solid wall (destructible)
@@ Line 1,358: / Line 1,358: @@
 <Tons of pics would allow for measurements of hull-down straight from hangar. would be useful, but who knows if it's any of use. Mention particular trash examples like ST-A2 being too tall for 1 cover and too short for next one, maybe.>
 ====Use of terrain====
@@ Line 1,366: / Line 1,378: @@
 <I think sturer emil or that m901 could be good to mention here, as well as japanese tanks with active suspension control and that potato of Type 75 MLRS, as a borderline experience>
 ====Specific extreme examples for RB and AB====
 <Explain why hulldown behind destructible obstacle is not a sin sometimes, mention HEAT and RB specifics>
 <Shturm-s and all those tanks that put their weapon down to hide in RB>
 <Maybe also Type 60 SPRG and it's stupid ability to hide behind 0.3m tall destructible things, RB perspective>
 <Explain why it is sometimes possible to use destructible obstacles in AB, maybe use FV4005 as a role model>
 ==Angling and related things==

@@ Line 4: / Line 4: @@
   |id = [[File:Icons War Thunder.png|60px|none]]
   |id-background = #871000
-  |info = This member has been playing War Thunder since<br /> 2016
+  |info = This member has been playing War Thunder since<br /> 2018
   |info-background = #871000
   |info-color= white

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 {{DISPLAYTITLE:Bangerland}}
 {{Userbox/Windows}}
 {{Userbox
-  |id = [[File:WW Artillery logo.png|60px|none]]
+  |id = [[File:Icons War Thunder.png|60px|none]]
-  |id-background   = red
+ |id-background = #871000
-  |info            = ATGM main, which likes his indirect strikes. Incoming artillery fire!
+ |info = This member has been playing War Thunder since<br /> 2016
-  |info-font-size  = 11
+ |info-background = #871000
-  |border          = red
+ |info-color= white
 }}