2C bis - Revision history

U75945355: /* Pros and cons */

2024-11-04T08:19:10Z

‎Pros and cons

U75945355: /* Main armament */

2024-11-04T08:14:58Z

‎Main armament

U44629479: Edits

2024-10-26T17:14:38Z

Edits

U44982996: shell filler update

2024-10-02T16:10:42Z

shell filler update

U44982996: updating the wiki since the gun elevation buff

2024-09-20T23:47:14Z

updating the wiki since the gun elevation buff

U44982996 at 05:04, 13 June 2024

2024-06-13T05:04:32Z

U28580205 at 23:17, 27 May 2024

2024-05-27T23:17:17Z

U44982996 at 14:22, 20 May 2024

2024-05-20T14:22:45Z

U44982996 at 18:23, 14 May 2024

2024-05-14T18:23:31Z

U44982996 at 16:46, 14 May 2024

2024-05-14T16:46:57Z

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 * Has a dozen crew members, highly survivable
 * 155 mm howitzer will decimate anything even above its BR
 * Neutral steering gives the tank decent reflex mobility
 * Can climb over rough terrain with ease due to its World War I design
 '''Cons:'''
 * Extremely huge, easily spotted and targeted by any enemy
-* Armour is mediocre at best
+* Armour can only stop up to heavy MG
 * Cramped frontal crew compartments, losing driver and gunner in a single shot is quite common
 * 155 mm howitzer has long reload time and unfriendly shell trajectory
 * Limited turret traverse, very prone to rear attack

@@ Line 83: / Line 83: @@
 |-
 ! ''Arcade''
-| rowspan="2" | 24 || rowspan="2" | ±10° || rowspan="2" | ±100° || rowspan="2" | N/A || 8.1 || 11.2 || 13.6 || 15.0 || 16.0 || rowspan="2" | 22.4 || rowspan="2" | 19.8 || rowspan="2" | 18.2 || rowspan="2" | 17.2
+| rowspan="2" | 24 || rowspan="2" | +20°/-15° || rowspan="2" | ±100° || rowspan="2" | N/A || 8.1 || 11.2 || 13.6 || 15.0 || 16.0 || rowspan="2" | 22.4 || rowspan="2" | 19.8 || rowspan="2" | 18.2 || rowspan="2" | 17.2
 |-
 ! ''Realistic''

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 {{main|Schneider 155 C (155 mm)}}
-The 2C bis has a 155 mm Schneider howitzer in its two man cast turret. Its velocity is extremely low and its reload rate is abysmal. The armament takes time and practice to utilize effectively, especially with its horrible shell velocity and curved trajectory. So, engaging targets further than 300 meters can take some practice. Given the extreme shell drop, the cannon often needs to aim up a lot to hit targets at normal fighting distance (~500m), significantly limiting the cannon's effective range.
+The 2C bis has a 155 mm Schneider howitzer in its two man cast turret. Its velocity is extremely low and its reload rate is abysmal. The armament takes time and practice to utilize effectively, especially with its horrible shell velocity and curved trajectory. So, engaging targets further than 300 meters can take some practice. Given the extreme shell drop, the cannon often needs to aim up a lot to hit targets at normal fighting distance (~500 m), significantly limiting the cannon's effective range.
 This cannon is housed inside a front turret that gets obstructed by the commander's position behind, preventing the gun to aim towards the rear. Thus it is important to angle the hull such that the turret's firing arc contains all dangerous directions within.
-On the plus side, with 11.22 kg TNT equivalent of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be one-shotted by this howitzer. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a great -20° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
+On the plus side, with an explosive filler of 11.22 kg TNT equivalent, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be knocked out by this howitzer with a single hit. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a great -20° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
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 ;Enemies worth noting:
-* [[BT-5|BT]]-5/7: those light tanks can be very threatening in the hands of an experienced tanker. They are very fast and agile, so they can show up at any location surprisingly fast. Their cannons are also powerful enough to penetrate the 2C bis' armour at any range, and usually knock out a few crews. Luckily, their armour is poor so a hit anywhere (or sometimes a near miss) can disable them. If the 2C is under their attack, angling the hull can help increase protection: while the effective thickness still won't be enough to stop a 45 mm AP, the 2C's large tracks and wheels can sometimes weaken the shell's kenetic energy.
+* [[BT-5|BT]]-5/7: those light tanks can be very threatening in the hands of an experienced tanker. They are very fast and agile, so they can show up at any location surprisingly fast. Their cannons are also powerful enough to penetrate the 2C bis' armour at any range, and usually knock out a few crews. Luckily, their armour is poor so a hit anywhere (or sometimes a near miss) can disable them. If the 2C is under their attack, angling the hull can help increase protection: while the effective thickness still won't be enough to stop a 45 mm AP, the 2C's large tracks and wheels can sometimes weaken the shell's kinetic energy.
 * [[15cm sIG 33 B Sfl]], [[Ho-Ro]], [[Spj fm/43-44]]: these tanks are armed with a large caliber howitzer just like the 2C bis, posing a huge threat with HE overpressure. Usually 1-2 shots from them can completely destroy a 2C bis. But they have weak protection, so a direct hit or a near miss (especially close to their open compartment) can wipe them out. If you are aware of their presence, it is best not to engage unless they are reloading or distracted.
-* Any enemy tanks in deliberate uptier ([[KV-1 (Family)|KV-1]], [[M4 Sherman (Family)|M4 Sherman]], [[T-34 (Family)|T-34]], etc.): Unlike many "low tier derp gun" tanks at low rank, the 2C bis benefits greatly from its huge crew count and empty hull space, which allows the tank to endure several hits from these tanks and capable of firing back, often destroying them in the process. In certain maps (especially maps with corridors or urban maps), the 2C bis can perform surprisingly well against an opponent at a much higher BR, with "Skill Matters" and "Balancer" awards being easily achievable. While the 155 mm is more than capable of taking out these tanks, they either have enough armor thickness or angled armor that allows it to survive some shots at certain places. As such, avoid aiming at their tracks or angled part of their armor if you are aware that these armor are enough to dissipate the explosion damage, and instead aim at certain deflective angles that would cause the pressure to went into the weak turret or hull roof and cause overpressure, such as turret mantlet or side profile.
+* Any enemy tanks in deliberate uptier ([[KV-1 (Family)|KV-1]], [[M4 Sherman (Family)|M4 Sherman]], [[T-34 (Family)|T-34]], etc.): Unlike many low-tier HE-wielding tanks at low rank, the 2C bis benefits greatly from its huge crew count and empty hull space, which allows the tank to endure several hits from these tanks and capable of firing back, often destroying them in the process. In certain maps (especially maps with corridors or urban maps), the 2C bis can perform surprisingly well against an opponent at a much higher BR, with "Skill Matters" and "Balancer" awards being easily achievable. While the 155 mm is more than capable of taking out these tanks, they either have enough armor thickness or angled armor that allows it to survive some shots at certain places. As such, avoid aiming at their tracks or angled part of their armor if you are aware that these armor are enough to dissipate the explosion damage, and instead aim at certain deflective angles that would cause the pressure to went into the weak turret or hull roof and cause overpressure, such as turret mantlet or side profile.
 === Pros and cons ===

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 This cannon is housed inside a front turret that gets obstructed by the commander's position behind, preventing the gun to aim towards the rear. Thus it is important to angle the hull such that the turret's firing arc contains all dangerous directions within.
-On the plus side, with 7.7 kg of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be one-shotted by this howitzer. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a great -20° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
+On the plus side, with 11.22 kg TNT equivalent of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be one-shotted by this howitzer. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a great -20° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
 {| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center" width="100%"

@@ Line 68: / Line 68: @@
 {{main|Schneider 155 C (155 mm)}}
-The 2C bis has a 155 mm Schneider howitzer in its two man cast turret. Its velocity is extremely low and its reload rate is abysmal. The armament takes time and practice to utilize effectively, especially with its horrible shell velocity and curved trajectory. So, engaging targets further than 300 meters can take some practice. Given the extreme shell drop, the cannon often needs to aim up a lot to hit targets at normal fighting distance (~500m), but it just happens to have very limited elevation angle (+10°), severely limiting the cannon's effective range.
+The 2C bis has a 155 mm Schneider howitzer in its two man cast turret. Its velocity is extremely low and its reload rate is abysmal. The armament takes time and practice to utilize effectively, especially with its horrible shell velocity and curved trajectory. So, engaging targets further than 300 meters can take some practice. Given the extreme shell drop, the cannon often needs to aim up a lot to hit targets at normal fighting distance (~500m), significantly limiting the cannon's effective range.
 This cannon is housed inside a front turret that gets obstructed by the commander's position behind, preventing the gun to aim towards the rear. Thus it is important to angle the hull such that the turret's firing arc contains all dangerous directions within.
-On the plus side, with 7.7 kg of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be one-shotted by this howitzer. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a good -10° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
+On the plus side, with 7.7 kg of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be one-shotted by this howitzer. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a great -20° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
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 * Armour is mediocre at best
 * Cramped frontal crew compartments, losing driver and gunner in a single shot is quite common
-* 155 mm howitzer has long reload time, unfriendly shell trajectory, and low elevation
+* 155 mm howitzer has long reload time and unfriendly shell trajectory
 * Awfully slow top speed
 * Limited turret traverse, very prone to rear attack

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 Being comprised of large, flat, vertical armour plates, the 2C bis does not have a revolutionary armour scheme. Many dedicated anti-tank guns such as the Soviet 45 mm 45-K, the US 37 mm M5/M6 guns, and the British 40 mm 2-pounder can penetrate this tank frontally from medium to short range without any problem. Larger cannons will have no issue dealing with the 2C bis. Autocannons can also be a threat, especially from the thinly armoured sides. The lower hull sides are composed of 22 mm plates, meaning that a skilled M2A2 or T-60 player can penetrate the sides with ease. However, some slight angling can somewhat mitigate this issue. The large tracks of the 2C bis can obscure the front plate and make it harder to penetrate. In addition, there are some fuel tanks and extra 22 mm plates surrounding said fuel tanks, making for a nearly 50 mm effective thickness.
-The 2C bis' true survivability lies in its crew count. 12 crew members are placed throughout the vehicle, meaning that even if the crew up front is entirely knocked out with an APHE shell, there are a number of aft-facing members ready to replace them. This can give the 2C bis a near comical amount of survivability as it can be continuously penetrated, seemingly disabled, and suddenly it can return to battle.
+The 2C bis' true survivability lies in its crew count and empty hull space. Since the tank has 12 crew members that are placed separately at the front and rear of the vehicle, meaning that even if the crew up front is entirely knocked out with an APHE shell, there are a number of aft-facing members ready to replace them. This can give the 2C bis a near comical amount of survivability as it can be continuously penetrated, seemingly disabled, and suddenly it can return to battle.
 '''Armour type:'''

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 {{Specs-Tank-Mobility}}
 <!-- ''Write about the mobility of the ground vehicle. Estimate the specific power and manoeuvrability, as well as the maximum speed forwards and backwards.'' -->
-The 2C bis utilizes a diesel-electric hybrid drive system. Two Sautter-Harlé inline 6 diesel engines power electric generators which then engage with electric motors at the rear sprocket. Like the Pz.Bef.Wg.VI P, this means that the 2C bis can neutral steer and theoretically go just as fast in reverse.
+The 2C bis utilizes a diesel-electric hybrid drive system. Two Sautter-Harlé inline 6 diesel engines power electric generators which then engage with electric motors at the rear sprocket. Like the [[Pz.Bef.Wg.VI P]], this means that the 2C bis can neutral steer and theoretically go just as fast in reverse.
 The 2C bis accelerates to its top speed quickly, regardless of the terrain it drives on, but this is only 15 km/h. The 2C bis will certainly be the last tank to the fight, but on the other hand the quick reverse acceleration can prove helpful in close quarters.
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 This cannon is housed inside a front turret that gets obstructed by the commander's position behind, preventing the gun to aim towards the rear. Thus it is important to angle the hull such that the turret's firing arc contains all dangerous directions within.
-On the plus side, with 7.7 kg of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a good -10° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
+On the plus side, with 7.7 kg of explosive filler, the Mle1915 shell will obliterate whatever it touches at the BR of the 2C bis, and even many way more advanced tanks at a much higher BR can still be one-shotted by this howitzer. As long as the shell makes contact anywhere, it is almost guaranteed to knock a vehicle out. Open-topped vehicles can even be knocked out by splash damage, as this is basically an artillery piece on tracks. Lastly, the gun has a good -10° gun depression, allowing it to fight on hills with relative ease.
 {| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center" width="100%"
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 * [[BT-5|BT]]-5/7: those light tanks can be very threatening in the hands of an experienced tanker. They are very fast and agile, so they can show up at any location surprisingly fast. Their cannons are also powerful enough to penetrate the 2C bis' armour at any range, and usually knock out a few crews. Luckily, their armour is poor so a hit anywhere (or sometimes a near miss) can disable them. If the 2C is under their attack, angling the hull can help increase protection: while the effective thickness still won't be enough to stop a 45 mm AP, the 2C's large tracks and wheels can sometimes weaken the shell's kenetic energy.
 * [[15cm sIG 33 B Sfl]], [[Ho-Ro]], [[Spj fm/43-44]]: these tanks are armed with a large caliber howitzer just like the 2C bis, posing a huge threat with HE overpressure. Usually 1-2 shots from them can completely destroy a 2C bis. But they have weak protection, so a direct hit or a near miss (especially close to their open compartment) can wipe them out. If you are aware of their presence, it is best not to engage unless they are reloading or distracted.
 === Pros and cons ===

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 The '''Char 2C bis''' is an experimentally modified [[2C|Char 2C]] that primarily differs in its main armament. Following a decision made in December 1922, a standard Char 2C was modified at La Seyne from 1923 to 1926 and designated Char 2C bis, an experimental super-heavy tank with a 155 mm Schneider 155 C howitzer in a rounded cast steel turret. The main armament had a muzzle velocity of 200 m/s. The three separate machine gun positions were removed and more powerful Sautter-Harlé engines were installed. The tank weighed around 74 tonnes in this configuration. The modification was only temporary, as this experimental super-heavy tank was returned to its original state after 1934.
-Introduced in [[Update "Apex Predators"]], the Char 2C bis has a playstyle comparable to the Char [[2C]]. However, since it is equipped with a short-barreled 155 mm howitzer, the reload time is substantially longer than most adversaries it will face during combat, players need always make every shot count in this experimental super-heavy tank. Despite being a super-heavy tank, its armour is not thick enough to stop the majority of tank rounds fired at it, and as such the 2C bis relies entirely on its huge crew count of 12 and empty hull space to survive. Staying behind the frontlines and acting as artillery is a feasible strategy, but due to the low velocity of the ammunition, this is extremely challenging for inexperienced players. Though with a careful aim, mastering the howitzer can be very rewarding, especially since it can obliterate even tanks at a much higher rank or BR. Always be aware of your surroundings and stay close to allies to prevent being isolated and overwhelmed by enemies.
+Introduced in [[Update "Apex Predators"]], the '''Char 2C bis''' has a playstyle comparable to the Char [[2C]]. However, since it is equipped with a short-barreled 155 mm howitzer, the reload time is substantially longer than most adversaries it will face during combat, players need always make every shot count in this experimental super-heavy tank. Despite being a super-heavy tank, its armour is not thick enough to stop the majority of tank rounds fired at it, and as such the 2C bis relies entirely on its huge crew count of 12 and empty hull space to survive. Staying behind the frontlines and acting as artillery is a feasible strategy, but due to the low velocity of the ammunition, this is extremely challenging for inexperienced players. Though with a careful aim, mastering the howitzer can be very rewarding, especially since it can obliterate even tanks at a much higher rank or BR. Always be aware of your surroundings and stay close to allies to prevent being isolated and overwhelmed by enemies.
 == General info ==
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 |-
 |}
+Since each shells are modelled individually, you should only loaded the tank with enough shells that you would realistically need to reduce the ammo rack size. Typically, 10 shells would be enough to deal with enemies in a single sortie.
 === Machine guns ===
 {{Specs-Tank-Weapon|2}}
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 == Usage in battles ==
 <!-- ''Describe the tactics of playing in the vehicle, the features of using vehicles in the team and advice on tactics. Refrain from creating a "guide" - do not impose a single point of view but instead give the reader food for thought. Describe the most dangerous enemies and give recommendations on fighting them. If necessary, note the specifics of the game in different modes (AB, RB, SB).'' -->
-As stated before, angling the hull around 40 degrees at any range can increase survivability and make the armour somewhat useful. If you are not sure about how far a target is, use the rangefinder, even at close range, since a miss will have you waiting almost half a minute to reload. The dreadful top speed will sometimes work in your favour, being that the first "wave" of enemy vehicles has already been dealt with. The 2C bis does not do well against multiple vehicles. The quick reverse acceleration can work in your favour in urban environments.
+Compared to the "normal" counterpart the [[2C]], the 2C's bis powerful yet tricky-to-use 155 mm howitzer offered a much more devastating damage output. While the tank is still vulnerable to airstrike and flankers, it can be effectively used as a much tougher, albeit slower version of the [[Ho-Ro]] or [[15cm sIG 33 B Sfl]]. Because of this, despite its antiquated appearance, the 2C bis can reliably defeat even the much more advanced tanks at higher BR should its gun handling is well understood.
-Sitting in the rear and lobbing artillery at the enemy is a possible strategy, but the low velocity and high arc of the rounds make this difficult. Eventually, a dedicated anti-tank SPG will likely disable or knock out the vehicle. The 2C bis performs better at mid-range (100-400 m) encounters where tracking targets can be easier. Surprisingly, despite its size, getting "Shadow Strikes" is possible in urban areas.
+As stated before, angling the hull around 40 degrees at any range can increase survivability and make the armour somewhat useful. If you are not sure about how far a target is, use the rangefinder, even at close range, since a miss will have you waiting almost half a minute to reload. The dreadful top speed will sometimes work in your favour, being that the first "wave" of enemy vehicles has already been dealt with. The 2C bis does not do well against multiple vehicles.
 Use your machine guns to clear obstacles that may trigger the HE shell's fuse prematurely. The 2C bis doesn't have a coaxial machine gun, which can be a problem when clearing obstacles as the hull guns have limited firing arcs. Turning the entire hull to shoot down fences and trees can be quite tedious, so always do it ASAP when you arrive at a comfortable position.
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 * Has a dozen crew members, highly survivable
 * 155 mm howitzer will decimate anything even above its BR
 * Neutral steering gives the tank decent reflex mobility
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 * Extremely huge, easily spotted and targeted by any enemy
-* 155 mm howitzer has long reload time and unfriendly shell trajectory
+* Armour is mediocre at best
 * Awfully slow top speed
 * Limited turret traverse, very prone to rear attack
 == History ==